Swine Flu - one or two injections?

[Thumps]

http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Pandemic-f ... ?WT.srch=1

This site seems to suggest two for immuno-compromised folks.. or have i mis-read it?

Nope, that's what it looks like to me too.

Having said that, I just had the Pandemrix jab a couple of hours ago. Mild pain in the injection site, otherwise I feel fine. Like an idiot I said "I read somewhere that it's meant to be in two doses?" AFTER they'd given me the single jab Ah well. Will see how I feel tomorrow!

[lizzyie]

Thanks to you all for the replies - I haven't even got a date yet and my GP doesn't know if I should have one or two jabs, it is a bit worrying. I am trying to avoid crowded places but don't know how long it takes before you are covered by the jab after having it.
Lizzie

[Ailsa]

I got the call from my GP on fri - going in on wednesday!

I ask whether it was the 1 or 2 jab vaccine - the receptionist didnt know but said the nurse would look at my history etc and let me know what i would need when i go on wed!

[missyh]

It is two jabs for immunosupressed people. You have to have them 21 days apart, although I have to phone my Dr's nearer the time for my second appointment to make sure that they have supply in!
I feel ok generally, My arm still feels sore and I had an upset tummy the day after, but that has now settled. I hope thats all I get.
Hope this helps.
Lots of love

[Mike]

got mine this afternoon but nothing was mentioned about 2 jabs. Will let you all know when I get back.

[Thumps]

I had it in one - feel fine today apart from a very slightly sore arm and an unrelated UTI

[laurajadedaniels]

had swine flu jab today, i felt fine when it went in big needle so it obvoustly went deep.

sat down in the doctors surgery for a bit and felt a bit sick and a bit kinda not on this planet but didn't hurt going in.

i'm not so good with injections i normally either faint or feel sick after so i'm probably not the best person to be giving advice

mike wanted me to add the health advice is 1 jab at the moment but could be changed 2 but don't know yet if they will call us back ( blooming hope not i will need a sick bucket then)

x

[Mike]

I had it in one - feel fine today apart from a very slightly sore arm and an unrelated UTI

Thats what I thought UNTIL the middle of last night and my arm was hurting quite a bit. Never had so much pain from any injection but the needle was big so probably much deeper than normal.

[Ailsa]

Had my jab this morning - have to go back in 3 weeks for part 2!

Was ok till a little while ok when it started to hurt like a bugger!!! Top of my arm aches like its all bruised, when i move it aches bit like muscle strain!!

[dkjane]

I got the H1N1 last week and feel OK. I said..NO..at first.
Then I gave in !
Called the Dr's office today to find out who the manufactur was..they could not tell me....strange!

Press release of the German Professional Association of Environmental Medicine (Deutscher Berufsverband der Umweltmediziner – DBU).

From 26. October 2009.

Swine flu [H1N1] vaccine is unsuitable for patients with chronic multi-system illnesses. Pandemrix® poses substantial health risk with respect to mass immunization programs due to the lack of proof of safety. Because of the producer’s release from liability by the German Federal Government (BRD), the risk of adverse reactions and/or permanent damage due to the vaccine rests with the patient.

The German Professional Association of Environmental Medicine (DBU) has, in spite of press releases from the BRD, the Paul-Ehrlich-Institute, as well as the vaccine producer’s assurances of safety, serious concerns relating to Pandemrix® (GlaxoSmithKline), the only vaccine which has been approved for mass vaccination by the BRD.

The DBU discusses at this point neither the medical use of immunization in general nor the necessity of such measures in the, up until now, mild course of the swine flu pandemic.

Our criticism is directed only against the pandemic vaccine Pandemrix®.

■There exists considerable doubt as to the effectiveness of the vaccine: during the licensing phase, the vaccine tested had a 40% higher portion of virus antigen (5. 25µg) than the vaccine (3.75µg) now being delivered. An unequivocal consensus has not been reached as to whether the vaccination should be given once or twice a season.
■There exists considerable doubt concerning the safety of the adjuvanted active amplifier since it is being used for the first time. The vaccine contains 27.4mg AS03, an emulsion of polysorbate, squalene and tocopherol. Sufficient studies are lacking, because in the test phase, only the development of antibody titers was determined as a surrogate criterion, and not any potential adverse reactions.
■The producer as well as government agencies have concealed the fact that squalene, if used subcutaneously or intramuscularly is an inflammatory immune activation immunogen, unlike when ingested. (Squalene is, among other things, for example, naturally contained in olive oil.)
■Autoimmune diseases can be provoked by squalene; already existing ones can be activated. Squalene has been connected with the emergence of Guillan-Barré Syndrome (GBS) and is now considered a trigger for Gulf War Syndrome (GWS). In animal studies squalene brought on rheumatoid arthritis.
■Squalene from food sources is mainly incorporated into membranes in the body. The production of squaline antibodies resulting from an immunization sets off chronic inflammation of the membranes, which explains diseases such as Gulf War Syndrome and also degenerative neurological diseases such as Multiple Sclerosis, Amyotrophic Lateral Sclerosis, Chronic Inflammatory Demyelinating Polyneuropathy and Guillan-Barré Syndrome.
■The delivery of vaccine in multiple dose ampules is obsolete. In single dose ampules the mercury used for preservation, as in thimerosal – which is included in Pandemrix – would be unnecessary. Also, mercury has been proven to set off autoimmune diseases.
■Since the vaccine has not been tested on either young children or pregnant women (Ethics Commission objection), the call to give preference in the first phase of vaccination to precisely this particularly endangered segment of the population represents an improper and totally unjustifiable field test.
■The vaccine poses a higher risk than the swine flu itself for patients with environmental illness and for patients with compromised immune systems (e.g. AIDS).
■The vaccine producer GlaxoSmithKline (GSK), according to the contract with the BRD, is largely exempt from liability. In case of damage from the vaccination, the affected vaccinee would have to sue the government and therefore the country of Germany, usually a futile exercise.
■To avoid the trap of liability, the doctor giving the vaccination must meticulously inform the patient of all risks concerning the vaccination and the vaccine. It is recommended to give this information in the presence of an assistant and to have it be confirmed by the patient’s signature. The explanation should also include the liability features. Also the indication that other, lower risk vaccines are available in Europe and that due to a faulty decision by the German government, they are currently not available to the German population. This information should definitely be included in the explanation.
For general and environmental health considerations the DBU urgently advises against carrying out a vaccination with Pandemrix®.

Dr.med. Hans-Peter Donate for the board of the German Professional Association of Environmental Medicine (DBU)

Translation by CSN - Chemical Sensitivity Network.

For more information on Pandemrix®, here is the manufacturer’s summary of product characteristics. Here is a quick look at one section on possible side effects:

Caution is needed when administering this vaccine to persons with a known hypersensitivity (other than anaphylactic reaction) to the active substance, to any of the excipients, to thiomersal and to residues (egg and chicken protein, ovalbumin, formaldehyde, gentamicin sulphate and sodium deoxycholate).

Editor’s Note: Content on this blog is provided for informational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for the advice provided by your physician or other healthcare professional. You should not use this information for diagnosing or treating a health problem or disease, or prescribing any medication or other treatment.

[Mike]

To avoid the trap of liability, the doctor giving the vaccination must meticulously inform the patient of all risks concerning the vaccination and the vaccine. It is recommended to give this information in the presence of an assistant and to have it be confirmed by the patient’s signature. The explanation should also include the liability features. Also the indication that other, lower risk vaccines are available in Europe and that due to a faulty decision by the German government, they are currently not available to the German population. This information should definitely be included in the explanation.
For general and environmental health considerations the DBU urgently advises against carrying out a vaccination with Pandemrix®.

On the form we had to fill out there at the bottom along with the batch number etc there was a section saying has the risks/benefits been explained to the patient and consent been given. I'd hardly say that anything was discussed although I was happy to have the shot. We were given a leaflet with very little information and the nurse just said roll your sleeve up and jabbed us without asking anything.

There are I believe 2 different vaccines of which one is a nasal spray containing live virus which obviously us tx patients cannot have and the other 1 is a dead virus

[lizzyie]

dkjane, I find that information very worrying, I am due to have the Pandemrix jab on Saturday! I asked my GP which one I was having and I had to wait while he looked the name up, he said he didn't know much about it but a lot of patients weren't taking the offer up - even the uptake for the normal flu jab had been low he said. I am starting to worry as I am on very high doses of immune tablets and had rejection on day 3...........how many of you have had the Pandemrix jab and have any of you decided not to have it?
Lizzie

[Thumps]

I can't find any reference to the "German Professional Association of Environmental Medicine" on the web other than the article itself. Any cross references we can read?

I had the Pandemrix, in a single dose, on Monday. Aside from a slightly sore arm on the Tuesday, I've been absolutely fine.

It's up to the individual, but in the end it's a numbers game.

Even if you look at the scarier stories, the chances of you having a serious reaction to the vaccine are really very tiny. (I don't count a sore arm as a bad reaction).
However, the chances of becoming seriously ill as a result of catching the flu (seasonal, swine or otherwise) are much higher!

So, I'll take the extremely small potential (possibly scaremongered) vaccine risk over the known and very real danger of catching the 'flu. I was very ill with it 2 years back and it's what precipitated my sudden decline to needing a transplant from a previously stable 20-25% function.

If you're worried contact your nephrologist, I reckon. I asked several of the clinic team if they'd recommend getting the vaccination and all said yes without hesitation. Why would I not trust them on this when I have previously?

[Aileen]

I'm with Thumps on this one - 'ordinary' flu hastened the all but demise of remaining kidney function last christmas, resulting in a hastily brought forward transplant in February of this year. Hence I had 2 injections last Saturday, ordinary flu in one arm and Pandemrix in left arm. I don't have to add anything about a sore left arm as I see this is well documented on topic already! It was pretty much ok after a couple of days though. Which is reassuring as I have to have Pandemrix part deux in three weeks time .

Again regurgitating Thumps (sorry Thumps!) I trust my transplant team absolutely, they are pro H1N1 injection after weighing up all odds and permutations so it's a no brainer. I wouldn't NOT have it, after informed discussions with experts who have a vested interest in my future. AND my kidney; they operated on me after all

It's great to be in full possession of the facts but there is a fine line between being informed and being scaremongered. I guess it's up to the individual to balance the scales though

Best to everyone, you're looking good Thumps

Aileen x

PS I WILL post my California pics when I have figured out how!

[lizzyie]

Thanks for your reply Thumps, but I have just found out I am having the Celvapan jab made by Baxter. I agree with all you said and have decided to go ahead, will let you know if I get any side effects.
Lizzie